AI-Powered Podcasting & Honey Trap Marketing – Deirdre Tshien – Creating The Greatest Show – Episode # 046

by | Jul 26, 2023 | Content, Creating The Greatest Show

Our special guest for today is Deirdre Tshien, a seasoned serial entrepreneur who boasts an impressive track record of founding and leading seven successful businesses across five industries in the past nine years. Deirdre is not only the author of the Honey Trap Marketing book but also the host of the Grow My Podcast Show. She is also the Co-Founder and CEO of Capsho, a groundbreaking AI-powered podcast-content copywriting platform. Deirdre delves into her background, recounting her diverse experiences and discussing the highs and lows she encountered while launching podcasts. Deirdre also explains how to build Content Honey Traps, what The Content Dripping Strategy looks like in practice, and how your Show Notes Funnel can become a powerful lead generation tool.


  • ​​Simply publishing a podcast is not enough to gain recognition and success. Just like growing a business, nurturing a podcast requires a deliberate and strategic approach.
  • Be mindful of how to strategically funnel listeners toward a desired outcome. For instance, implementing a well-structured show notes funnel can be instrumental in turning leads into conversions.
  • If you’re seeking to help your podcast thrive, remember the power of focus, intention, and a strategic approach.
  • Define your podcast’s purpose, understand your audience, and build a well-crafted funnel to channel your efforts effectively.
  • It’s crucial to define the specific audience you are targeting. Identifying your ideal avatar and persona might sound cliché, but without a clear understanding of your audience, your podcast might suffer the dreaded “pod fade,” losing momentum and impact.
  • The show notes funnel aids in attracting and understanding your audience, while the Content Dripping Strategy ensures that your content is delivered enticingly, enhancing the overall podcast experience.
  • The Content Dripping Strategy is a marketing strategy that involves delivering content to the user in batches over a pre-defined period. Instead of offering all the content at once, parts of the content are given to the audience in a controlled or scheduled way over a period of time.
  • Directing your listeners to access bonus clips/information through the show notes gives them a reason to share their names and email addresses. This transforms your podcast into a lead-generation machine.

READ MORE: 11 Easy Ways to Turn Your Podcast into a Content-Generating Machine

READ MORE: How to Repurpose Your Podcast Content Like an Expert Marketer

READ MORE: Identify Your Podcast’s Purpose with This Simple Framework

Quote of the Show

“At the end of the day, you still need your listeners to get value from your podcast. Otherwise, why are they listening to it?”

– Deirdre Tshien

Connect with Deirdre

Clips from the Episode

Ways to Tune In

Episode Transcript


Casey Cheshire: All right. We’re doing it. My goodness. We’re doing it. We got the camera going. We got the microphones on. We are ready to rock this thing. I’m excited. I can’t wait to introduce you to my guest today. She is so cool. She’s a serial entrepreneur. Now I say that about. Many of the guests cause I get a chance to chat with entrepreneurs, but she is a serious serial entrepreneur.

Casey Cheshire: Founded, LED over seven businesses, across five industries in the last nine years. [00:01:00] And since we’ve last chatted, those numbers probably have all increased by at least three or four. Author of The Honey Trap Marketing Host of the Girl, my podcast show, co-founder and CEO of CAPS show. Deidre, welcome to the show.

Deirdre Tshien: Thanks so much for having me, Casey And I have I’ve changed my ways. I have not launched any businesses because I’m all about focus. That’s, yeah. It’s

Casey Cheshire: Oh my gosh. And when we focus our efforts, man, that I can’t wait to hear about that because that’s like a laser beam, sunlight, you can get a sunburn, but laser beams, man, those things cut through anything. So I can’t wait to hear

Deirdre Tshien: yeah.

Casey Cheshire: And I’m focused. I’ll have to talk after about focus.

Casey Cheshire: That’s a rare commodity. I love that. I wanna just pass this thing off to you. I wanna learn about podcasting. I wanna learn about the techniques and the things that you’ve been working on. Deidre, pull back the curtain for us on your show and experience and share your most important strategy [00:02:00] for a great podcast.

Deirdre Tshien: Oh gosh. This is a tough question for me, Casey, as because there’s so many things I wanna share with everyone. So I’ll just tell you a little bit about the background, how I got into podcasting because I think this, that’ll be, that’ll hopefully be useful. I launched my first podcast. I.

Deirdre Tshien: Almost three years ago now. And I did that because I had a coaching business at the time. I was working on a digital marketing agency business. Covid hit and we had to transition online. The way that we decided to trans transition online was to actually have a coaching business where we were helping e-commerce businesses with their digital marketing.

Deirdre Tshien: And so a mentor told me if you’re gonna do this, and if you wanna become known as an expert in your niche, You have to start publishing you have to start finding your voice and getting your message out there. And we figured that the best way to do that was through podcasting. And so I had no idea what I was doing.

Deirdre Tshien: I didn’t have a microphone. I didn’t know [00:03:00] how to edit. I just figured it out. I fumbled through it all. I had a, I ended up getting something like a $53 micro on Amazon. I ended up, if I made a mistake while recording, cuz I didn’t know how to edit, I would actually stop and then I’d. Like rerecord

Casey Cheshire: whole thing.

Deirdre Tshien: Because I didn’t know how to do simple things like editing. That was how much of a newbie I was. And I very quickly realized, because I think a lot of us go into podcasting and we think that, oh, by, just by the act of put publishing and putting it out there that you’re done, that’s it.

Deirdre Tshien: And suddenly you’re gonna become known and everyone’s gonna be wanting to either be on your podcast or get you on their podcast, et cetera. And it just doesn’t work that way, just like a business. Growing a podcast is like growing a business. And so I had to figure this thing out and I’m like, oh my gosh, what did I get myself into?

Deirdre Tshien: I have to, I’m trying to grow a business and now I have to also grow a podcast. And, I again, like all things, we [00:04:00] fumble our way through the thing until we figure something out. And that’s how and we can talk about the content dripping strategy in a while, but that’s how I actually came across the content dripping strategy was because just by doing it and figuring out what was working.

Deirdre Tshien: And finding ways to get my message out there and not just get my message out there, but to have to get leads and then importantly to nurture those leads into a sale. That was essentially what I had to figure out. I did that I think, gosh, four, five months in to launching that podcast. We did our first five figures in the coaching business and in that first year, We did over $220,000 in that coaching business.

Deirdre Tshien: Yeah. And so I’m excited to share some of the tips or the trick tools, trips advice that I give advice on what I did, the sort of things that I did. But to come back to your question about, what is, the advice I think it really is like we were super intentional and this comes back to focus, the word [00:05:00] focus that we started this episode off with.

Deirdre Tshien: But it’s being really, again, laser focused about what is the outcome that you want from your podcast. Some people, and it’s fine as well if you don’t know, but you have to know that you don’t know. Because some people launch a podcast just because they heard it was a fun thing to do and it was like, cool.

Deirdre Tshien: If that’s the case. Y your expectations have to be aligned to that. If it’s just gonna be a fun thing to do then, and that’s all it is, then you can’t get down on, your listeners aren’t growing or your list isn’t getting, isn’t building or you’re not getting sales. If you have started your podcast with an intentional.

Deirdre Tshien: Outcome, then everything has to align to that outcome. Everything from who is it that you’re speaking to, what are you speaking to them about, and how are you intentionally actually getting them into some kind of funnel? And we can talk about, I talk about the show notes funnel. But that was the thing that I had to figure out because when I started my podcast, again, I didn’t know what I was doing.[00:06:00]

Deirdre Tshien: I didn’t have a Clear outcome. I knew that it was a way for me maybe to grow my business in some way shape or form, but until I became really crystal clear about what that was and what that looked like, and I built my show notes funnel off the back of it, that was when I was able to actually get leads and conversions.

Casey Cheshire: Yeah. And a lot of people listening to this have those branded podcasts and many of them are using an BM strategy to try to connect with their guests and eventually do business together. But a lot of times what I hear is, yeah, we had a great conversation. They’re brilliant. We might even be BFFs now, but the business hasn’t quite come.

Casey Cheshire: And so then that leads to almost that B2B pod fading where we’re just, ah, we’re not getting that return. And then people are real, are questioning what are we doing? We’re spending money here. How do we get that? So what’s missing there?

Deirdre Tshien: Yeah. So [00:07:00] I feel like that’s, so that’s a very different strategy as well. And just so that I’m. I get my head cause I don’t wanna talk about the wrong thing, Casey, so what you’re talking about is using a podcast to get a guest on and you are essentially using that as a platform to sell that particular guest into your service or your program, whatever it is.

Deirdre Tshien: That’s the strategy that you are specifically

Deirdre Tshien: talking

Deirdre Tshien: about.

Casey Cheshire: I, some people have been doing that where it’s like that’s what their focus is. Like they’re intentionally trying to get guests that way. Are you talking about getting guests or getting getting listeners to become audience?

Deirdre Tshien: Yeah. Yeah. And that’s, so they’re all different. Yeah. So they’re all different strategies. And there’s no kind of right or wrong, it’s just what works best for your business. And, unfortunately, transparency, I also did that strategy. I also tried that. I had another podcast where that was the whole, that was the funnel as such.

Deirdre Tshien: It was get guests on yeah, record an episode and then, try to get them into, now I can’t say that I pro, I [00:08:00] implemented it. The best way because I am not a natural I don’t even wanna say sales per, and I don’t, and when I say sales, okay, let me, because this is also a mindset thing for me for sure, is, the whole I was gonna say, I’m not a natural salesperson now.

Deirdre Tshien: What does that mean? It doesn’t really mean anything. In, in the scheme of things I think I wasn’t natural at leading, at transitioning the starting point of, Hey, you’re a guest on my show. I wasn’t a natural at actually transitioning that into, by the way, let’s hop on a call and talk about this, how I can help you not in those exact words, because that’s very self-serving, so you don’t wanna do it that way, that’s the outcome that you’re looking for.

Deirdre Tshien: I wasn’t great at that. And so I know that was a hundred percent on me, not, it wasn’t the strategy, right? Any strategy out there, every strategy works. All of them. They’ve worked before and they will always work, but it’s [00:09:00] just in what works best for you and your personality and what you want out of it.

Deirdre Tshien: For me, I think what was blocking me when I, and I know this is a

Casey Cheshire: By. That’s brilliant. It’s

Casey Cheshire: like

Deirdre Tshien: what we’re talking about.

Casey Cheshire: your quote right there. It’s amazing.

Deirdre Tshien: But what? For for me, I think what that process made me realize was that wasn’t actually the business that I wanted to be in or how I wanted to do my business. And what I mean by that is cuz I completely switched, I, it made me realize that actually I like, a more of a b2c.

Deirdre Tshien: Business model. That’s actually what juices me. I like to be able to think about from a almost quote unquote mass perspective, how can I, get those listeners and then how can I really make those listeners sticky and, and nurture through a funnel. And then how do I get, those mass, obviously that keeps, going down as the funnel does.

Deirdre Tshien: The numbers go down. But then how do I get the people who are at the end to convert? That’s what juices me. That’s what makes me [00:10:00] really excited. And even though. I had spent a lot of time on this B2B podcast and I got really down on myself and I was like, this thing isn’t working.

Deirdre Tshien: great thing is that I came out of that with clarity. I was like that’s just not the way that I personally wanna do business, or that’s not what juices me. And that’s a great, like learnings and clarity is some, like we pay. I am happy to pay money to do that and time because it’s just like even when I used to come from corporate as well.

Deirdre Tshien: And people used to always ask me what’s the next career step? That’s always what do, and I’d always be like, I don’t really know, but I know what I don’t want.

Casey Cheshire: That’s

Casey Cheshire: just as

Deirdre Tshien: Exactly. And that’s what I learned from that journey of doing this. The b2b funnel myself podcast funnel myself was like, I know what I don’t wanna be doing.

Deirdre Tshien: And And that is worth time and money figuring out. Sorry, I know that was a massive

Casey Cheshire: No, but that’s I understand the [00:11:00] shift now because you are who you are and you love connecting with the guests. And you found a way to not only connect with the audience and make them loyal, but then to convert them. So tell me about those things. You dropped some hint, the show notes, funnel the show.

Casey Cheshire: Tell me about how you gathered your audience and you led them like the Pied Piper to the land of Revenue.

Deirdre Tshien: Yes. Cool. Okay. So I’ll talk about the show notes funnel and then maybe I’ll talk about the content dripping strategy cuz they’re one, one leads into the other. So the show notes funnel is again, let’s set context. This is probably more, I mean it can also work b2b, but not in the way that we were just talking about getting a guest on.

Deirdre Tshien: This is where so first of all, when I think about podcasting and how we make it successful, I’m like really focused on who is the specific audience. And I know we talk about this all the time no, your avatar and your persona, blah, blah, blah. It’s, it sounds very cliche, but it’s. This is the reason why it’s cliched is because [00:12:00] when I didn’t do this, I am massively pod faded.

Deirdre Tshien: I was like, this is not working. I’m not only pod faded by my business in, if I dunno the particular audience, I it, the business does not work. So I’m a big convert preacher of know who it is you’re speaking specifically to. But it doesn’t just stop there because the next thing then is. And this is a bit that I think we a lot of us miss.

Deirdre Tshien: It’s yes, we know exactly who we’re speaking to. And I actually have a client a cap Jovian, who knows exactly who he’s speaking to. He speaks to faith based dads and he knows it inside out because he himself is one. But then when he goes to. What he’s speaking to them about. He’s what do faith-based dads care about?

Deirdre Tshien: They care about family, and they care about finances, and they care about faith, and they care about

All the

Deirdre Tshien: They care about

Deirdre Tshien: all these things. Exactly. And then it’s but you then you’re not speaking. You are speaking to everyone again.

Casey Cheshire: Good point.

Deirdre Tshien: So this is this. Second thing is that we need to not only know who we’re speaking to, but what specifically, the [00:13:00] one thing that we’re speaking to them about and why this is important from a practical perspective is because if you want your show to get discovered, if you want you to get discovered, you need to become an expert in one thing and one thing.

Deirdre Tshien: only You cannot be an expert in finance fitness and family and faith and all the things. You can only be an expert in one thing. And again, why that’s important is because, When we think about search, discoverability by search, let’s say you’re on Google or anywhere else, it’s still machines doing all of that heavy lifting of trying to get you discovered.

Deirdre Tshien: It’s still the algorithms and it’s still relatively, I know that AI is, it’s exploded to the scene and it’s oh my gosh, it’s so smart and it’s so good. But really underpinning these search engines is still quite, like relatively rudimentary AI where Needs to, it can only categorize you really in only one thing.

Deirdre Tshien: Like it’s actually not smart enough to categorize you in more than that. So if you start talking about a lot of different things, [00:14:00] then you are actually less likely to get picked up by the search engines because you haven’t built the credibility in that one thing. And so that’s why from a practical perspective, actually doing this is so important.

So That’s

Casey Cheshire: I literally just experienced that the other day for fun. We were asking chat g p t to give us bios about ourselves and it told me that I was basically on first. By the way, I’m impressed that even knows who I am. Like cuz I’m just Casey Ch like I’m not anybody here. But it said, the expert in marketing automation, because my last company and the book, everything was all about marketing automation and Pardot.

Casey Cheshire: Not, cause I had talked about one thing for a long time. Now I’m talking about podcasting, but I need to keep talking about podcasting and make sure I keep talking about it so that I can eventually. And almost that AI report is like a representation of the content that I have out there, and so I need to just keep going to make sure I get labeled at that one [00:15:00] thing and not confuse it.

Casey Cheshire: To your point. That’s really brilliant. What is that one thing?

Deirdre Tshien: Yes. And you need to, your content has to be, what you talk about on the podcast has to be aligned to that one thing. And then we go get into the content dripping strategy. So once you know what your content is, then obviously the guests that you get on to your podcast. Now I do personally, I do a mix of solo and guest episodes.

Deirdre Tshien: And even for the guest episodes, I actually edit them quite a bit. I narrate, I do narrations. I’m over that so that I can actually, take my list on a bit of a journey and, really juicy learnings. And f for me, I’m like, okay, I, everything that I do is aligned to I only really invite guests on if I know that what it is that they’re talking about can be so valuable to my audience.

Deirdre Tshien: Again, a bit of a different strategy. It’s not about getting those guests to become clients of mine. I literally just get them on for the

Casey Cheshire: the value that your audience is

Deirdre Tshien: my audience. [00:16:00] Exactly. Exactly. And and from there I then it, I then leverage the content dripping strategy, which is I publish an episode every week.

Deirdre Tshien: When I publish an episode, I actually do promotional things as we do, I send an email out to my list. I, I post about it on social media as we all do now. Social media is not, I. Going to be the place that you get listeners from. I just wanna make that really clear. It is a place that you can get awareness.

Deirdre Tshien: It’s a place that you can remind your followers that, hey, this, something’s gone live and that you still, you actually have a podcast. You remember that I have a podcast. But it is exactly, but it is not the place that you’re going to look, I shouldn’t say you’re never going to, I have had listeners come through from social media, but like handful, not.

Deirdre Tshien: Not the flood that you’re gonna be hoping for. So I wanna set that expectation because, a lot [00:17:00] of us get really down on the fact that we spend all this time on social media. So I’m happy to go into, so what I do social media strategy, but I just wanna lay the overall scene.

Deirdre Tshien: Okay. So

Casey Cheshire: it’s not

Casey Cheshire: social so where is the flood? Where do we find the flood?

Deirdre Tshien: Oh, okay. Yeah let me get to that. Okay. Let me just, I, there’s so many things I wanna talk about. This is what I mean. Okay. So first week promote the, yeah. The podcast. And then what we generally find is that the podcast, it’s. You, we get a spike in listeners and then it d dies down.

Deirdre Tshien: And so then what I do is I, on the second week, I actually do a blog post about the same, leveraging the content from the episode. And then I do the promotional promotion on blog posts again, spike, and then that dies down. And then the third week I actually do a YouTube video on that episode.

Deirdre Tshien: And then, so again, and I promote it. Spike and then it dies down. And literally, if [00:18:00] you can see that means that every week you are, you’re releasing a podcast episode, you’re releasing a blog post, you’re releasing a YouTube video, and then you’re just using the other platforms to raise awareness and to drive, traffic to these things.

Deirdre Tshien: And the reason why this is so effective is because what I figured out and what I didn’t realize, And a lot of us think about this, about it this way, is that again, if we are really focused on what our outcome is from, say, our podcast, so for me it was how do I A, yes, get leads as in get discovered, but also convert?

Deirdre Tshien: How do I actually have my podcast convert them? Now conversion looks and feels different to a lot of us for me. When I was reading a book by Daniel Priestley called Oversubscribed, and in it he talks about the seven hour rule that for anyone to do business with you, they need to spend at least seven hours with you.

Deirdre Tshien: And that could be very well by just consuming your content, coming to get to know at, to getting to know [00:19:00] and trust you. And so when I was like, oh, there’s something in this. How can I get people to spend at least seven hours with me? So it becomes a no-brainer. That was when I started to plug in all of these different.

Deirdre Tshien: Ways for them to keep learning from me because we all also learn differently. And the more that we can keep them in our world, the tighter that that the stickier that it makes them, so by being able to actually give them other avenues to follow me on or learn from me, et cetera, it actually started to create this, almost this vortex of you can’t, you can never, it’s like hotel California, right?

Deirdre Tshien: Like you can never leave this place.

Casey Cheshire: Right.

Deirdre Tshien: And and that was when, when I was speaking to new clients and especially in that month, my first five figure month when I asked them why it was that they decided to invest, it was so validating because it was like, I followed you for so long.

Deirdre Tshien: I’ve consumed so [00:20:00] like you gives so much value that I felt guilty for not paying you. And that was just, I barely had to hop on a sales call because they already got so much value that it was like the sales call is really just okay, just tell me how much it is. Tell me exactly how it works, and then let’s do it.

Deirdre Tshien: And that is the best way to almost not have to sell. Which, coming back to my experience of. Not being a salesperson like that was what was really authentic to me. And so that’s the content dripping strategy. Now that leads into the show notes funnel. So let’s talk about that, if that’s okay.

Deirdre Tshien: Which is how do you build a list, because it’s great to have someone follow you through, your, in, I call it a publishing house, like in all the rooms of your publishing house. But. Ultimately you need them. You need a name, and you need an email address. You need a way to contact them directly.

Deirdre Tshien: And I think we know being in business, like building like your email list is your number one asset. [00:21:00] That is the thing that you need. So that was also the next outcome. I was like, okay, I want this podcast to be a way to build my list. And and so that’s how I came. Came up with the show notes funnel.

Deirdre Tshien: So how the show notes funnel works is, I will actually, let’s talk about cause I think a lot of us have guest based in podcasts. So what I will do is I will actually especially either if the. The interview went a little bit longer or there were particular detail that you dove into about one particular aspect of, say, their strategy.

Deirdre Tshien: I would actually clip that out and I will say, cuz again, I do narrations, but if you, even if you don’t do narrations, you can just put this in at the end of the episode just after the fact. You can say, Hey, remember when. Dere was talking about the content dripping strategy. She mentioned it.

Deirdre Tshien: She goes into detail about how this can work for your podcast. And the great thing [00:22:00] is that I’ve left that as a bonus clip completely free in the show notes. So just go head over there. Click on the link that says exclusive bonus clip. And just, and listen to how she lays out the content dripping strategy in detail for free.

Deirdre Tshien: And you put that behind as this, as an opt in. And that’s how you start to build your list from your podcast. And you can see that it’s becomes a self-fulfilling thing because when people join your list, then you promote your next podcast episode to them. This is way more effective of getting listeners on your podcast and actually having them spend that seven hours with you than to try to blast it on social media each and every day.

Deirdre Tshien: Or be really intentional. Build your list and promote to that list. That’s

Casey Cheshire: so it’s like extra content or the real good stuff is behind some sort of wall. Is that, that the.

Deirdre Tshien: Yeah. And [00:23:00] I like to be honest, and you can even see this on my podcast, if you go to grow my podcast show one of the latest episodes I did was with Lauren Paal. So she’s from T Media and she was talking about pier. She dropped so much value and so I was like in, even in the. The public, like the actual episode.

Deirdre Tshien: I gave away all so much of that value. But because I, like in my questionings, we really went deep into particular parts of it. I knew already that just by listening, even if you didn’t opt in just by listening to the podcast episode, you were gonna get so much value. But hey, if you want even more, if this is the thing that, the piece, the missing piece maybe of what it is that you need for what you do, then.

Deirdre Tshien: Yeah, then please go and get even more value. But you don’t need to as well. Because there’ll be another, that I’ll have on, and that’s the thing that actually maybe it’s on SEO and it’s like that’s the thing that actually I need to unlock. That’s the piece that’s missing. Hey, let me get more into that.

Deirdre Tshien: So that’s how I think about [00:24:00] it, is I want, I still wanna give the value on, because. At the end of the day, you’ll, you still need your listeners to get value from your podcast. Otherwise, why are they listening to it? But what is that extra piece, that deep dive that maybe it’s even more of the story if they went particularly long about the story?

Deirdre Tshien: It’s like Cliff, leave them on a cliffhanger. It’s Can you you won’t even believe what happened next, but you know what, I’m like, we, I really wanna get into the strategy, into the value. So I’m gonna leave the rest of the story in as a bonus clip. If you wanna find out what happened next, go and get that bonus clip.

Casey Cheshire: Wow. So you would you even clip it out of the episode itself? I.

Deirdre Tshien: yeah.

Casey Cheshire: So you’re about to go, let’s say we were gonna go deep on this topic right now. We would say we clip it out. And then they heard us, they heard you intro this. They heard me ask a couple questions and I’m like, wow, this is cool.

Casey Cheshire: And now we’re going deeper in on the recording. But you would take this and you’d put it somewhere else.

Deirdre Tshien: [00:25:00] yeah. Yep. You could very well do that. Yeah. So it’s. Yeah, it’s just how can you use your podcast to build your list? I literally had someone like DM me essay and he’s oh my gosh, I love that episode. I, it was actually about the one Lauren, just because that was one of the most recent ones that we released.

Deirdre Tshien: And he’s I love, and he’s, he’s hacking me like, he’s I love what you’re doing with this. I’ve opted in, I’m telling all my, all my entrepreneurship friends that they have to listen to this podcast and opt in for because. At the end of the day, like we all as, as long as we’re getting value from it, we don’t mind.

Deirdre Tshien: There’s nothing inauthentic or sleazy or anything about doing this because it’s like, Hey, I’ve already given you value, but if you want even more because this is a particular thing that’s gonna unlock, you know what it is that you need right now in your podcast growth or your business growth or whatever it is, then I invite you to, and it’s free.

Deirdre Tshien: Go get that for free. But I just don’t wanna overwhelm everyone on this episode because not everyone is. At this [00:26:00] stage, yeah, potentially. That’s the underlying message.

Casey Cheshire: And to that last point, rather than overwhelming everyone, if they wanna take it a step further, they can go get it. If they don’t, they can keep listening on. So you, So

Casey Cheshire: like a highly curated podcast. It’s the show you’ve created such a. Inter, it’s entertaining, it’s fast paced because you’re cleaning things up and you’re moving things around.

Casey Cheshire: So you spend a lot of time on each episode.

Deirdre Tshien: Yeah, I do. So I do the, obviously the recording. I also do the content editing by way of, obviously I will do, script my narrations and work out which bits I want, and then my team does the rest after that. So I spend maybe, so let’s say it’s an hour recording and then it’s probably, another hour to.

Deirdre Tshien: To make the like to edits and scripted and stuff [00:27:00] like that. So for me, about a couple hours a week and then my team takes it from there and does all the editing. Obviously capture, which we can talk about it. That creates all of my title, description, my podcast, website, content. All I show notes, like it does all

Casey Cheshire: Let’s talk about that cuz there, there’s a lot cuz I actually love your titles cause I was going through and you mentioned the podcast with Lauren, but there’s some really good ones here and it’s on a similar topic to this show, so I wanna just give it, we’ll definitely put it in the show notes so people can click through.

Casey Cheshire: But the idea of advanced niche, a nicheing, niching but Finding that focus again and optimizing for SEO and Guesting win. You have some really cool titles, the Humanity Error, how to use AI to Fuel Your Creativity. There’s just some really good episode titles and I know sometimes you can have a great conversation, but if the title isn’t powerful, then people may not spend that extra muscle click to get there.

Deirdre Tshien: totally. The title is so important, even from a again I nerd out on search and [00:28:00] discoverability quite a bit, but if we talk about even podcast player seo, so how you get discovered in the podcast place, so Spotify, iTunes, et cetera, or Apple Podcasts I should say. It all comes down to definitely, the highest elements is like your show title and your show description as in, so Grow my podcast show.

Deirdre Tshien: You can already tell people who wanna grow their podcasts. That’s, and then the description, but the third to get your ep, your episode discovered. Title, your is the number one most important thing. It’s not even the description, it all comes down to the title. So it’s actually really important to get your title right.

Deirdre Tshien: And that’s the, some of the smarts that we’ve built into cap show. So just to really as a quick introduction to CAP show for anyone who doesn’t know about it. It’s an AI powered content podcast content writer. So what our users, or what we call our caps, Chian, do they upload their audio or video file [00:29:00] and in under 10 minutes, Capture creates the first draft of your title, your description, your podcast website content, your social media captions, your email, your blog post, LinkedIn article, YouTube description, and it pulls out quotes as well.

Deirdre Tshien: And I say I’m very intentionally saying first draft because again, it’s ai. So it’ll get you 70, 80% of the way there, but you have to be involved in the process. And. And when I say we’ve built, so we’re marketers. You can hopefully hear, in all of the things I’m talking about, like we nerd out on marketing.

Deirdre Tshien: And so we’ve built in a lot of really important things, like to your point, the seo, how titles are formed, how even the description and all the things, I’ve got I’ve created a framework called Content Honey traps. And those content honey traps have eight mental models that are designed to create curiosity and [00:30:00] hook your audience in to just do the next step.

Deirdre Tshien: And the next step might be to press play on your episode, or the next step might be to opt into your list or whatever that is. And that’s built into capture show. So those mental models are built into cap show. And so it’s very much a tool to market. It’s not just a tool to get. A summary or anything else, it’s like it is designed to grow your audience and grow your income, grow your list, and grow your income.

Deirdre Tshien: I’ve had, even as gosh, a couple days ago, someone, one of our users dmd me and he actually sent me a screenshot of his list of his download numbers. He’s just by using CAP Show. And, oh, actually this is a funny story. So he actually decided to compare one of our competitors with Cap Show.

Deirdre Tshien: So he used one of our competitors for one episode 19 downloads, and then he used CAP Show for the next episode, 1,223

Deirdre Tshien: downloads. [00:31:00] Yeah, it’s crazy

Casey Cheshire: what’s the magic sauce in there? What kind of cool spices are you putting You, you got a little, it’s not just pepper and salt going on here. We got some things happening.

Casey Cheshire: What’s the magic inside a cap? Show that what are some of the things that it’s thinking about when it’s writing these titles?

Deirdre Tshien: Y you mentioned that I have a book called Honey Trap Marketing, or even you can go to grow my, Grow My podcast show and listen to the first two episodes because I talk about the content Honey Traps. In there. I talk about the eight mental, we talk about the eight mental models that we’re thinking about.

Deirdre Tshien: So this is how we think about anything to create curiosity or hooks. That’s the stuff, but, yeah, it’s there’s a bit of an art to combining that with actually from the SEO part of it, which is how do be really intentional that it’s, actually highlighting the topic that you are talking about.

Deirdre Tshien: So capture bundles, all of that, and yeah, makes it really easy. It’s, I don’t like. Even when I use it, I’m like, wow, [00:32:00] this is a piece of art. I’m like, I get pleasantly surprised as of all by our, our own product, which is super cool. So much fun.

Casey Cheshire: Okay. And so are there certain numbers of shows that you can do with a subscription to cap show? Or

Deirdre Tshien: Yeah.

Casey Cheshire: just throw in episodes and let it just rock it.

Deirdre Tshien: Yeah the, if you subscribe, it’s, each month is four episodes, so it gives you access to four. You can always buy additional credits or for anyone. We have agency clients as well, obviously who do more than eight, more than 12. And then we have, we start to have volume base discounting for them.

Deirdre Tshien: But yeah, but the base, public thing, public pricing is four episodes a

Casey Cheshire: Got it. Okay. Sick. Very cool. Very cool. Man, and it’s got titles. And I know we, we talked about titles, but I was, looking at it, there’s not that this is a sales episode, but like this is exciting. So it is show notes [00:33:00] too, and all the different things are all just

Deirdre Tshien: Yeah, and that’s, and then that goes back to my content dripping strategy. You know what I talked about? Because I spoke about blog posts and YouTube videos and other piece of long form content that you can help nurture your audience through. And we make it really easy because hey, capture creates a blog post for you based on your episode, and it creates a YouTube description.

Deirdre Tshien: So you know you could very well, Casey just. Slap this video up on YouTube, use capture’s YouTube description and you’re good to go. That’s how simple it is. That’s how simple we make it. So that’s, yeah, that it’s anchored capture show. What’s anchoring it is all of, the, our content dripping strategy, like what we figured out content honey traps, creating curiosity and all of the discoverability sort like secrets that we uncovered.

Deirdre Tshien: That’s all built into cap show.

Casey Cheshire: Okay, this is brilliant. So I would love to make something meta [00:34:00] happen right now. Can we talk about content, honey traps. Almost as if we haven’t talked about ’em before. But that first surface level and then wherever you think you would cut it, let’s just, let’s say that out loud that we’re cutting it.

Casey Cheshire: And then what we’ll do is we’ll link to the content, honey trap, whatever part would be your normal next step link. We can link to that in our show notes.

Deirdre Tshien: Oh, okay. Okay. So you want me to promote content anti traps in a way, or Promote slash teach us that first part. And then we’ll just, and just say clap your hands. We’re like, okay, this is where, we won’t cut that part out cause we want to hear, this is where you would normally cut it off. But then in the show notes we’ll still link to that thing so people can go experience the entire process.

Deirdre Tshien: Yeah. Okay, cool. Con traps are designed to be short, so I’ll just, so this is gonna be pretty short, but [00:35:00] if you wanna know the secret, the one secret I. To how I was able to go from $0 to over $220,000 in one year in my coaching business. Then you have to check out content honey traps. So if we stop there, and then whatever the call to action is.

Deirdre Tshien: So content, we’ll link that. in the show notes, cid:ii_lkbl0jqy0

Casey Cheshire: interesting. So in my mind, I thought you were gonna be teaching it but actually what you do is you promote, you put this teaser out and promote it, and then you cut it. So do you not like even share a little bit about what it is beforehand? Or you just literally cut it there?

Deirdre Tshien: You can. So it depends on, so the eight mental models and I like, you can see it, either listen about it or it’s in my book, for example which is, yeah, it’s called Honey Trap Marketing. But the eight mental models. Is designed to create curiosity. [00:36:00] So the one that I used is I just then was called the Paradox.

Deirdre Tshien: Which is almost it’s contrasting like an end outcome with an unbelievable fact. It’s like an unbelievable fact around about contrasting. Right now. There are. Way better examples. Like another example that, the one that actually I modeled it off was there was a presentation that was called how to Go From How to How I Made a Million Dollars with a $19 product and a toilet seat, right?

Deirdre Tshien: It’s like I have to go watch that. I have to go listen to this thing cuz I wanna know how she made a million dollars with a $19 product in a toilet seat. So that’s like the paradox and that’s the one that I used, which, There are different degrees of it. But it’s kinda if you wanna know how I went from zero to $220,000 in one year with my coaching business, then you have to go check it

Casey Cheshire: Wow. Okay. So I’m understanding [00:37:00] the mental model now that they’re the mental models and one of them, which we just displayed for everyone, and we’ll link to it, is the paradox version. And so that, yeah it’s wow, you went from zero to 200. Plus thousand K in a coaching business. How the heck did you do that?

Casey Cheshire: Okay, I’m gonna go follow the next step.

Casey Cheshire: Got it. This is really selling me on the book. I’m literally, I can’t wait to go get it after this. And I don’t say that to everyone.


Casey Cheshire: But yeah, no, this is cool. And if that’s just one mental model, how cool would it be to have seven plus more?

Deirdre Tshien: Yeah, exactly.

Casey Cheshire: Super cool. Where can people get in touch with you? They want to get more information on this. They wanna just follow up with you, tell you how awesome the show was. All the things and also more information. Where do they go to sign up for cap show and all these things.

Deirdre Tshien: Yes. I’ll so I’ll start from the end. So cap, C [00:38:00] a p s h You can sign up for a free trial and it’s super easy. Get in, try it with an episode of yours and see what happens. It’s. Yeah. Anyway it’s really cool and it is designed to be customizable and flexible. So you can actually build your own version of a description or a blog post or whatever it is, and it will still Yeah, work for you, which is so cool.

Deirdre Tshien: So that’s if you wanna reach out to me personally, I am most active on Facebook or LinkedIn. Probably LinkedIn is the best. And so just mention that you heard me on Casey’s podcast and. Yeah, love to have a chat about what you learned and how I can help you even more.

Casey Cheshire: So cool. So cool. I feel like I, I’ve learned so much, but also I’ve learned so much about how to. Point into the next things I’m gonna learn and honestly, just even doing this interview, I am like, I am in the honey pot right now. Just being like, I need to go get [00:39:00] more. That was nice. I gotta get more.

Casey Cheshire: So I can’t wait to go get the book do a demo or a trial cap show and do all those things. So thank you so much for coming on here, hanging out with me, teaching me a few things, dealing with my crazy questions, and just helping me see the light.

Deirdre Tshien: Yeah, it was my privilege. Thank you so much for having me on.

Casey Cheshire: Absolutely. And for those listening, if you learn something and I freaking, no, you did. Cause I literally have two pages of notes over here, front and back. Then share this with someone. Be a thought leader, one person, three people, 9,000 people, whatever. Just get good information in other people’s hands and do check out those links.

Casey Cheshire: They’ll be in the show notes. And man, Deidre, thank you so much again.

Deirdre Tshien: Yes. Thanks for having

Casey Cheshire: All right everyone. This has been another exciting episode of creating the Greatest Show. We’ll see you all next time.


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